Once again, I’ve attended the CERIAS Security Symposium held on the campus of Purdue University. This is one of several posts summarizing the talks I attended.

The end of Christopher Painter’s talk transitioned nicely into the Fireside Chat with Painter and CERIAS Executive Director Gene Spafford. Spafford opened the discussion with a topic he tried to get the first panel to address: privacy. “Many people view security as the most important thing,” Spafford observed, which results in things like CISPA which would allow unlimited and unaccountable sharing of data with government. According to Painter, privacy and security “are not incompatible.” The Obama administration works to ensure civil liberty and privacy protections are built-in. Painter also disagreed with Spafford’s assertion that the U.S. is behind Europe in privacy protection. The U.S. and the E.U. want interoperable privacy rules. They’re not going to be identical, but they should work together. Prosecution of cyber attacks, according to Painter, aids privacy in the long run.

An audience member wanted to know how do to address the risk of attribution and proportional response now that cyber defense is transitioning from passive to active. Painter noted that vigilante justice is dangerous due to the possibility of misattribution and the risk of escalating the situation. “I don’t advocate a self-help approach,” he said.

Another in the audience expressed concern with voluntary standards concern me, observing that compliance is spotty in regulated industries (e.g. health care). He wondered if these voluntary international standards were intended to be guidance or effective? Painter said they are intended to set a “standard of care”. Governments will need to set incentives and mechanisms to foster compliance. Spafford pointed out that there are two types of standards: minimum standards and aspirational standards. Standards can also institutionalize bad behavior, so it is important to set the right standards.

Painter had earlier commented that progress has been structurally. An audience member wondered where the gaps remain. The State Department, according to Painter, is a microcosm of the rest of the Executive Branch. Within State, they’ve gone a good job of getting the parts of the agency working well together. They weren’t cooperating operationally as much as we could, but that’s improved, too. Spafford asked about state-level coooperation. 9/11 drove a great deal of state cooperation, but we’re now beginning to see states participate more in cyber efforts.

One member of the audience said “without accountability, you have no rule of law. How do you have accountability on the Internet?” Painter replied there are two sides to the coin: prevention and response. Response is more difficult. there have been efforts by the FBI and others in the past few years to step up enforcement and response. Spafford pointed out that even if an attack has been traced to another country with good evidence, the local government will sometimes deny it. Can they be held accountable? We have to build the consensus that this is important, said Painter. If you’re outside that consensus you will become isolated. A lot of countries in the developing world are still building capabilities. They want to stop it, but they can’t. Cybercrime is often used to facilitate traditional crime. That might be a lever to help encourage cooperation from other nations.

Fresh off this mornings attack of North Korean social media accounts, the audience wanted to hear comments on  Anonymous attacking governments. “If you’re doing something that’s a crime,” Painter said, “it’s a crime.” Improving attribution can help prevent or prosecute these attackers. The conversation moved to the classification of information when Spafford observed that some accuse goverments of over-classifying information. Painter said that has not been his experience. When people reveal classified information, that damages a lot of efforts. We have to balance speech and protection. The openness of the Internet is key.

Two related questions were asked back to back. The first questioner observed that product manufacturers are good at externalizing the cost of insecurity and asked how producers can be incentivized to produce more secure products. The second question dealt with preventing misuse of technology, with The Onion Router being cited as an example of a program used for both good and bad. Painter said the market for security is increasing, with consumers becoming more willing to pay for security. Industry is looking at how to move security away from the end user in order to make it more transparent. Producers can’t tell how their work will be used, but even when technology is used to obscure attribution, there are other ways to trace criminals (for example, money trails).

One other question asked how we address punishment online. Painter said judges have discretion in sentences and U.S. sentencing laws are “generally pretty rational.”  The penalities in cyberspace are generally tied to the penalties in the digital world. In seeming contradiction, Spafford pointed out that almost everything in the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act is a felony and asked Painter if there is room to have more misdemeanor offenses in federal law? Painter said there are misdemeanor offenses in state and local laws. Generally, Spafford says, policymakers need better understanding of tech, but tech people need better understanding of law.

There were other aspects of this discussion that I struggle to summarize (especially given the lengthy nature of this post). I do think this was the most interesting session of the entire symposium, at least for me. I’ve recently found my interest in law and policy increasing, and I lament the fact that I’ve nearly completed my master’s degree at this point. I actually caught myself thinking about a PhD this morning, which is an absolutely unnecessary idea at this stage in my life.

Other posts from this event:

• Opening keynote
• Panel #1
• Thursday keynote
• Panel #3
• Featured commentary and tech talk #3